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May 20, 2023

MemeCoin Mania and NFT Investing

PEPE and TURBO are the hottest MEME-Coins in town, but are they even real?

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PEPE and TURBO are the hottest MEME-Coins in town, but are they even real? Scott dives into the wild world of meme-crypto with his buddy Brett, who has been making a killing with these tokens. Find out how he does it and why he thinks it's the most fun he's ever had in trading. Plus, we explore The Memes by Punk6529, Nakamigos, Jack Butcher's Checks, and the reasons behind the NFT craze.

This is not investment advice or an endorsement of the securities or property mentioned.

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Unknown Speaker  0:00  
Intro Music

Scott McGregor  0:06  
I'm Scott McGregor @scottrades on Twitter. Welcome to the Hot Wallet, Podcast conversations about active investing and digital assets. Please make sure and press follow on whatever platform you're getting this on. If you're watching this on YouTube, smash the like button, press subscribe. So you get quality content from people who are not trying to scam you. You know, Brett, I was thinking earlier, everyone kind of has like a thing like, BitBoy, for example. I don't really know if that guy is not trying to scam me. And one of the main things that I want to do with this channel with this podcast is just give people great information. And be like, you don't have to buy anything, you don't have to buy what I own. And in fact, probably don't do that. It's a good idea if you don't want to lose money. And so I think that this is just a great platform for giving out good information, and not trying to get people to buy anything. So hopefully it's helpful for you. And that's one of the reasons that I wanted to bring someone like you on who is a good friend of mine. Give him some love everyone my brother from another mother at Crypto Bretton Twitter, longtime friend of the show, he drives an Audi but nobody's perfect. It's good to see you brother. 

Brett  1:21  
It is a reality RS three though it is turbo blue. So it's one of the better Audi's out there and you're gonna drive an Audi it might as well be that one. 

Scott McGregor  1:31  
I'm insanely jealous, actually. 

Brett  1:34  
As you should be. 

Scott McGregor  1:35  
I'm still driving the Honda and it's okay. 

Brett  1:39  
We have the Honda two we have we have one of those? Yeah, it's reliable. It gets you around. It does everything that it needs to do. It's not quite as exciting. But yeah, it is. It is a vehicle for transportation. But yeah, it's not nearly it. Let's put it this way. The Honda stays out of the garage, the Audi stays in the garage. 

Scott McGregor  1:58  
Nice one. I liked that. I call mine that daddy wagon. Oh, gotta take the daddy wagon to the park. 

Brett  2:05  

Scott McGregor  2:06  
So the reason I wanted to have you on my friend is because I feel like that guy in the meme that goes out for pizza, and then comes back holding the pizza, staring at a house that is on fire. And chaos is all around because, you know, I'm deep down the Bitcoin rabbit hole. I'm in the stock market. I'm trying to interpret what the Fed is doing. I am focused on crypto but more or less the regulation part the use cases. You know, I'm trying to orange pill as many people as I can. And I come back holding the pizza. And this frog coin is going crazy. And people like Raoul Pal are saying how can I buy this thing? So Brett, WTF is going on right now in the world of meme coins. What is a meme coin? How did you get involved? And how should regular everyday investors think about these? 

Brett  2:59  
Well, let's go back to like DOGE and SHIB. And I've, I think I've bought those a couple times and traded it, but I never got into it. And you know, I was thinking about this earlier, as far as a meme coin or anything like that. There's really no significant utility to it, right? I mean, I think Elon was talking about doing some things and I think maybe, Mark Cuban mentioned that you can buy some merch with DOGE for the Mavericks, I forget if that's actually happening still or not. But there's no utility to it. It's just fun. And people love it. And people get behind it and they rally for it. And some of them are doing so because they're making a lot of money. They got an earlier knew about it from the very beginning or the genesis. But others just you know, many people just like it for the community. And you know, if you think about, like, for example, the Turbo Toads I'm I'm reasonably heavy heavily invested in that one. Mostly because I just had a lot of fun on the discord servers, and I've met people. I had a One V One or one of one mentored for me, some guy created a pretty cool turbo Toad thing that I really loved. And you know, when you when you think about...well, are you familiar with the concept of a network state?

Scott McGregor  4:21  
Are you talking about like what Balaji (Srinivasaniji) is talking about? 

Brett  4:24  

Scott McGregor  4:25  
...very, very vaguely, maybe you can give me a little overview. 

Brett  4:29  
So I don't have it all in front of me. And I read a lot about it a long time ago. So I'm gonna butcher some of it. But you know, it's an active and engaged community that acts on behalf of the community has its own cryptocurrency governs itself, and fundamentally and at some point meets in person. And there's like maybe one other qualification that Balaji (Srinivasani) mentions for a network state. Again, I probably butchered that a little bit, but that's kind of the gist of it. And what I'm starting to see with some of these meetings, wins is some organic formations of of network states, people, you know rallying together for a cause, and whether or not that actually turned into fruition for something that is real, I don't know. And more than likely, probably not. But what some companies are trying to do is build these highly valuable communities that people want to join and want to be a part of, and advocate to get others to join as well. And what's so cool about the meme coin culture is that it happens on its own. And so you're getting sort of a catalyst for something that is community driven, that people want to be a part of, that, you know, there is a token for and at times, they're meeting in person in person events. And to some extent, you get merchandise and you know, physical objects, which if you see this, this is my seeds, the needs shirt. I got it sent to me the other day from @sergitosergito, on Twitter, search YouTube for detail, he is big into punks, and big into meat, it's and you know, I got a free shirt out of the deal. And it's really cool. And I wear it and it's a nice shirt. And you know, I'm a part of that community. So it's like, you're, you're, you're getting involved in something that is adding value that's fun, that you love that you meet cool people. And it's just different than if you buy Apple stock, you know, it's just completely a different scenario. And it's something that I don't know, you can feel like you're more of a part of and you're more impactful with. And I think that's part of it beyond just the intrinsic need to try to make a lot of money off of it. But I'm holding my Turbo I'm holding about that PEPE, I'm holding about a little Gooch, and I'm holding, holding those, and if they do something great, if they don't, you know, so be it. But it's, it's not anything that I'm relying on in any way, shape, or form, but I'm having a lot of fun with it. And those are the communities that I'm being a part of, and then I'm kind of participating in.

Scott McGregor  7:07  
Most communities rally around a certain cause or a movement. And when you look at something like Tesla, for example, a lot of people are rallying around the cause of clean energy, electric cars, et cetera, et cetera. What are the communities of these meme coins rallying around exactly?

Brett  7:26  
I think to a certain extent, some of it is just the anti community of, you know, normal fiat currencies and normal transactions. Like we can build things on our own, we can create something from scratch, we can, you know, do whatever it is that we want to do. And we don't need, quote, unquote, you or the big government to help us do that. You know, some of these communities, they have an intrinsic purpose. Some of them don't. And I don't necessarily feel like you have to have a natural cause, or, you know, an ultimate reason that you're doing it sometimes it's just that it's cool. And it's fun, and it's you meet nice people.

Scott McGregor  8:06  
What are you learning in some of these discord? Like, what are people talking about? What is what is the community actually like?

Brett  8:14  
So a lot of these communities, you know, to be brutally honest with you, there's some good ones, and there's some bad ones, but a lot of them are just, you know, talking about the coin, talking about the token to the noon, you know, buying more, buy the dip, all that stuff, and you're gonna see most of that, and just most any community that you go to lots of rocket emojis, I imagine lots of rocket emojis, lots of. And what's really interesting in some of these is, you don't really understand how little some of these people know, you know, I'll post I know, it's kind of silly, but I'll post some technical analysis and some charts on some of these meme coins, which really doesn't mean a damn thing. Because people are buying on emotion. But, you know, you're not really too concerned about the 200 day moving average, or the 50 day, you know, simple average on these in support. And, you know, it's not really that big of a deal. But you are concerned with, you know, $1 versus, you know, 75 cents, because $1 is like an even round number. And that's what people look at. Although most of these new coins are way, way, way less than $1. But what's interesting is, you know, a lot of these emerging meme coin meme communities are well, creating merchandise like, well, you can buy our T shirts and you can support us. You're creating like coffee mugs, T shirts, cool stuff that you wouldn't be able to get otherwise. Talking about, like, how can we help each other like, what kind of other alpha can you give us? What are you seeing what's going on? You know, some of the stuff that you would get in a paid sort of service. Now you have to be careful with, you know, who do you listen to? And is that information actually valid? And what you're going to find is there's going to be some people who we're there to help others and to you know, help them achieve something. And then there's other people who are there to scam you. So, you know, like you mentioned, potentially that boy, and that's another quick segue. Is he actually here to help people? Or is he here to like scam? Others out of out of their funds? What do you think?

Scott McGregor  10:20  
I mean, I have my own opinions, I've never met the guy at all. I do know that, you know, you and I, when we were first getting into crypto, we would look in watch some of these BitBoy videos, because we're just looking for influencers, who knew what they're talking about. And BitBoy was, you know, coming up early in the search results. You know, I feel like I haven't watched his videos for a long, long time. So I don't know. And I may be speaking out of turn, I just don't know what's going on with him. And he just seems angry about everything. You know, he's angry about regulation. He's angry about this angry about that he wants to be seen as someone who is right. He wants to be seen, in my opinion, as someone who has a lot of money, who's very successful, who does these videos, and a lot of people watch them. And you know that I guess that that's kind of his MO. Recently, I've seen him get involved with a token called $BEN. And I don't know too much about it, other than someone made this token. His name is Ben BitBoy's name is Ben. And so he kind of latched on to that. told everyone, he wasn't going to sell a certain amount of tokens, and then just recently actually sold a bunch of tokens, but said it was to raise funds for something else. And so I just don't know if you can really trust anyone. You know, I think trust is earned from someone who again, you know, like, as I kind of started the show off from people who aren't trying to sell you anything, you know, and I feel like, a lot of his videos in the early days, were very informational. We find out now that a lot of them were actually paid sponsorships, but he didn't let everyone know. And now that he now that everyone kind of knows that it's kind of expected that okay, he's gonna do these paid sponsorships. And so I really don't know what to think, other than, you know, just the line, do your own research, what makes sense to you? What is your timeframe? What is your horizon? How long do you want to hold this for? When do you need the money, that kind of thing? And so I think that's probably just a good rule for any influencer, even you and I talking about things right now. You know, if we mentioned tokens, we own NF T's we own, et cetera. Someone may think, Oh, well, that's, you know, that's an endorsement, I should buy it. But I don't think that's a good idea. Because who knows what you're going to do tomorrow, next week, next year, like, things change. And so I think he's a good warning for the industry, just generally of just be careful and look out for yourself, because you don't know what's gonna happen. You know, he may turn out to be an amazing lightning rod for regulation in this industry, and come out smelling like roses at the end. But just like people, look at Jim Cramer rely on Jim Cramer. And then you have other people who say, Oh, well, everything Kramer likes goes to zero. 

Brett  13:20  
Yeah, exactly. 

Scott McGregor  13:22  
So I think with any sort of investment, you really have to just understand yourself and what your goals are first, and then take everything in as information to either confirm or change your idea. 

Brett  13:39  
Yeah, I Yeah, you're right, we did first kind of get started with watching some some good boy videos, and, you know, you have to take everything in, like you said, Do your own research, and, you know, you don't really know who to believe or who to trust or anything like that. And that's what makes some of this stuff so difficult. You know, fundamentally, I'm a believer in crypto long term, I believer in Bitcoin long term, you know, some of the projects, both of which we invest in, but like, you know, somebody like Ben can get involved in Bitcoin, and then dump it, and then, you know, sell it off. And it's just, maybe it was for another project, maybe not, but for somebody who has, you know, a couple of $1,000 to their name, and they invest some of it for that purpose. And then it gets dumped like that, you know, it's it can be extremely disappointing. And kind of what I was leaning back into, and some of these people in these communities who don't really understand technical analysis or don't really understand what's going on, they're getting hit hard, and that's sort of the disappointing part of it is that, you know, those of us without much money or without much knowledge most, a lot of the people you read about on Twitter, they have some knowledge or they have some expertise, but many are just jumping into something and hopes for a better life. Like, I'll put this $1,000 that I have into, you know, XYZ meme coin, and I hope it 100x's. And that's, that's my gamble. And it's I mean, it really is happening. And, you know, I posted a chart one time and it's like, okay, this is we're approaching support, this is what's happened on the for our, you know, over the past few days, again, we're talking for our timeframes. Let's see what it happens, it's either going to bottom or we could see a bounce from here based on the consolidation that we're seeing. And somebody asked me to explain, like, what is this? What does this mean? So we have people who are trading in just buying and selling, with no real rhyme or reason. And, you know, they're kind of missing that expertise as to why they're buying it, and why they're getting involved from a technical perspective, from, you know, a fundamental, just emotional perspective, they're just buying it because they like it, and they want to be a part of it. And they hope that they're gonna make a lot of money. But you know, kind of going back to what we were talking about earlier with the what's going on in the forum's I'm seeing just a lot of nice people having a lot of fun with it. And I've had more fun in some of these meme coin forums than I've had, in most any other Discord server that I've been a part of, and I have a long list of them. It's just a lot of nice people doing cool shit, building, you know, building NF T's building new art, buying and selling, collaborating, getting away, like, you know, I made 100 of these first people, the minute you can have it for point oh 1/8 or something like that, just to cover some fees. And if you want a great if you don't want it, that's fine, too. And, you know, that's kind of like the the one of one that I got the other day, I just thought it was neat. And it wasn't even for sale. And I messaged the guy, the art the artists and said, Hey, I want to buy this. He's like, Oh, I wasn't even trying to sell it. But if you want to buy it, I bought it for like, I think it was point five eath something like that. And I'm proud of it. And on one another Discord server that's now my profile picture. Oh, so but it just kind of in from that I made a friend, you know, the artists, you know, now chat every now and then on Twitter, and you know, it's just, it's just cool. You know, it's just kind of like, kind of like Facebook back in the day, they needed to be cool now that it's cool now, but you know, they needed to create something for Facebook, that was cool. And that's what you're seeing in a lot of these memecoin discord servers, it's cool, people are having fun, and they're working together. 

Scott McGregor  17:33  
It does remind me of kind of my early days getting involved in the market, because I would get in, in on these forums and these kind of chat services about Canadian mining stocks. And someone would post a chart and be like, This is what's going to happen. And then that thing would happen. And it would be like, Whoa, I wish I knew how to read charts. And you know, I looked at this guy like an expert, like he knows what's happening and stuff. And so I do you see the benefit in that for people who want to get involved in trading and investing. But maybe, you know, aren't ready to open up a brokerage account or anything like that, but can do a uniswap thing on their phone, like I get that it's easier, the barrier to entry is lower. And so maybe there is going to be a net benefit out of this where it brings a whole bunch of new people to the regular market, you know, be at the stock market or, you know, further down into the crypto market. So I do see that aspect of it. And then of course, that community aspect of it. You know, you were a member at Stock Market Mentor, you understand like the stock kind of community and, and the value that you can derive from learning from a whole bunch of different people. So I do understand that. For sure. Like, like that clicks for me, that makes sense.

Brett  18:51  
Yeah. And I think that's that's it. Somebody.... I'll hold this person's name, but some I was asking about NFT's a year ago, something like that. And I was like, hey, which NFT's do I get into? And she was just like, you need to find a community. I was like, Well, what do you mean, she said, find a community that you vibe with that you like, that you want to be a part of, and, you know, make that your community that you want to participate in, and then from there, you'll kind of build off of it. And I knew what she meant, but I didn't really get it. And as a part of a few different discord servers, part of sock sock marketing enter, you know, but I wasn't sure what exactly I was looking for. And that's when I find found the Punk6529 The Memes and The Memes themselves. I mean, not necessarily meme culture, but just memes in general, really spoke to me. And that was sort of the first community that I really enjoyed and really started being a part of, and I think right now I am number 89 off all time right around there 85 All time for the top meme collectors, the top six, five to nine meme collectors. So what's cool about that it kind of gets you. Well, back when we lived in Canada, we, we had this really nice garden, I know I'm going off in a segue, but I'm going to tie this all together for you, we had a really nice garden because the soil is so fertile. And we grew all kinds of fantastic vegetables. And it was wonderful, and it was beautiful. And then one day I was sitting outside, I was watering the garden again. And I was starting to wonder, does this garden own me? Or do I own this garden, because I had to take care of it all the time in order to make it work. And I got a benefit out of it. But I had to put a lot of effort into it time, money expense, all of that. And so what's happening with the six five to nine memes right now is because I'm one of the you know, top, say 100 collectors, I get to mint, pretty much every single one that comes out. And I want to get them all in because I like them. But I have to make sure that I'm around for the meant. I have to you know, every Monday, Wednesday, Friday at 10 o'clock Central, I have to be there. It costs me point oh six, five to nine eath every single time. And if I miss one, then of course, I have to go back and buy it in the secondary market because I want to collect them all. And by continuing to collect them I keep I get the ability to mint them at a cheap price and anticipation that at some point in the future, they're going to be worth more than they are now. But I can't sometimes wonder, do I own the sort of my involvement in the community? Or does this involvement in the community own me, because now I'm so far down that rabbit hole, that it'd be really hard to leave, and I don't necessarily want to, but every single week, you know, call it point to eat, I'm spinning on these things. And I you know, I kind of have to because I've you know I don't I don't want to kind of fall off and not be able to meet some of these because you really don't ever know if it's going to be a limited edition 300 edition NFT that's going to be highly valuable, like the Nakamoto card right now is I think 10 ETH. It's been as high as like 25 ETH. And you kind of mentioned that at one point .06529. So, you know, you never know what's going to be to be out there. And you know, the NFT market right now is this the bear NFT market, I think we'll probably see some movement here soon. I think a lot of the meme coin money is going to probably come out of that and probably into some fundamentals like Bitcoin and likely into some NFTs at some point here in the future. 

Scott McGregor  22:43  
Explain to me and everyone else who Punk6529 is, how did how did you get introduced to this person? And then also, how did you get involved in starting to collect these NFT memes some of which you have behind you by the way I do on the wall? 

Brett  23:01  
So I'm sure some of us know who Punk6529 is? I do not. He is a bit of a mystery. My understanding is that he's either some kind of a former hedge fund manager or some type of person who's made a lot of money, you know, somewhere in the world. He I believe lives in Europe, based on time zones and things that I've seen. But I discovered him through two different interviews he did with Raoul Pal from Real Vision. And those interviews to me were mind blowing. I don't know if we're gonna have enough time to talk about all of this. They were two hour interviews each, I think, but basically the gist of it was the tokenization of everything. And ultimately, do we as humans, we as investors want to hold something in our own wallets? Or would we prefer to hold it in a centralized database? So the typical example is you buy a concert ticket to I don't know, Christina Aguilera or whoever it is that you listen to Scott 

Scott McGregor  24:12  
Taylor Swift, TayTay

Brett  24:13  
You buy a Taylor Swift ticket. Yeah. TayTay. And, you know, fundamentally, would you prefer to have that on the, you know, the Ticketmaster app, and have all of the information there and have to trade it through somebody else who has the Ticketmaster app? Or would you prefer to have it in your own digital wallet? And that sort of the key decision that I think the populace is going to have to make, you know, does it live in a centralized app owned by a private company? Or does it live decentralized in something like a Metamask wallet or something else? And that's what we've got to figure out and that decision I think, needs to happen. Not necessarily soon, but soon ish? Because if it doesn't occur...Are we don't get, you know, some kind of movement. My concern is that this sort of the momentum that we have for NFTs and you know, tokenization and you know, some of the use cases for it might kind of die down. You know, why bother if I can just hold it in a centralized app is easy. What's the point? And that's the kind of the decision that we have to make. I think those of us who were pro crypto are going to like obviously prefer to hold it in our own wallets. Like it would be just cool that I could send you my well... I wouldn't have a Taytay ticket, Scott. But on if you wanted to send me your she could maybe...

Scott McGregor  25:41  
She's at the top of her game, right now,

Brett  25:42  
 I'm not I'm not paying her prices. I'm not paying her prices. My my daughter wanted to go to a concert, and we couldn't get any tickets. It was like, over $1,000 US per ticket to get her I thought maybe, but you know, 

I don't know about these memes being worth it. But...Tickets to TayTay, at least for one week!

Maybe, maybe. But um, 

Scott McGregor  26:03  
no, but I understand what you're saying. Because what you're saying essentially is, is there value in being able to own something like a ticket to a concert, being able to send that to someone without a third party being involved, because the way it works right now, and we've seen this, Ticketmaster sells a ticket. And as soon as it gets bought, it goes on StubHub, which Ticketmaster, I believe, also owns and get sold at an exorbitant amount higher than the listing price. And the way that I think decentralized tickets could work is that you can sell them for that exorbitant price. But StubHub doesn't get as much of that money, the user would get more of that money. Is that is that kind of how you see it? 

Brett  26:50  
Why do you need Ticketmaster? And the question is, why do you even need Ticketmaster at this point, once you kind of the Taylor Swift tickets could be an NF T, they go on sale, whoever has a digital wallet buys it, it goes into their wallet, and it can be traded publicly wherever they want. I mean, it's the same thing as a membership pass for, you know, XYZ company or a meme card or anything else. It's the tokenization of an asset. And that's what's really exciting, going back to Punk6529, like the tokenization of a hotel stay, you buy a hotel, you're gonna stay in Banff for the week, and it turns out that you can't go, you sell that to somebody else over the blockchain. And it's whether it's an NFT, or something else, you sell that to me, I now have the NFT I own it is valid for these dates, I go to Banff and present it and they give me the room. The hotel generally, unless you're there's, you know, you're a criminal or you've done some bad stuff, they don't care whether Scott rents the room or breakfasts the room, they just care that they've gotten paid for it, and they've fulfilled their obligation. So, you know, it would be nice to be able to, you know, trade stuff like stays or assets, you know, without having to go through the hotel. But like, if you can't cancel your reservation, for whatever reason, what are you going to do with it? 

Scott McGregor  28:11  
Mm hmm. So the hotel would probably benefit more, because, you know, here's someone who isn't going to, let's say, I booked a hotel, and I have to cancel, okay, well, then it's up to the hotel to either resell that room. So they potentially take a loss on it. But then they could also lose money on eating at the restaurant, or you know, that's built into the hotel, or you have a great experience. And then you refer it to someone else, and they get money down the road. And so, yeah, I love that idea of being able to tokenize an asset or a commodity, or a stay at a hotel, and then being able to trade that openly and be like, oh, you know what, I actually can't go, but I know someone who can, here's my ticket, here's my NFT to the room, you get it, you stay. And the hotel still makes money either way. And they could probably set it up where if I do have to send you my hotel room, they would take a little off the top so they get a little bit more of that money that you're paying me, you know, so So there's essentially a way for hotels, in this example, to make money twice on one hotel room. 

Brett  29:21  
There's lots of opportunities. Even there's a company called StockX. Have you heard of StockX? 

Scott McGregor  29:26  
Yeah, I think they sell shoes, right? 

Brett  29:29  
Yeah, well, they they sell shoes and lots of valuable assets. It can be whether it's shoes, or clothing or other merchandise, it's kind of, excuse me, just hip stuff that people are going to want and a lot of it's, you know, apparel tight and stuff. But what they actually do is let's pretend that I have, I have this baseball and it's a really valuable baseball for whatever reason. I advertise it for sale and let's say it goes for $1,000. I then have to send it to stock X, they validate that it's real. And then they send it to the buyer. So, you know, with tokenization, with Blockchain, we don't really need that validation anymore. Because if I bought this baseball, and it's I'm able to prove it on the blockchain, prove that it's real, we then validate it. So all the all the fake handbags and you know, all the, I'm not into that whole area, but I know that Louis (Vuitton) bags are counterfeited a lot. I mean, we can we can validate that and tokenize ownership of that, we can do that with cars, we can do that with our health records, we can do that with housing, we can do that with most anything of value. And we're just now scratching the surface. So the whole ticket idea or the StockX idea or the hotel stay idea, those are sort of just really easy ways of kind of thinking of what we could do with it. The the fundamental piece that we're missing is like, so what's next? What are the big picture things that are going to happen? Like, is real estate going to go into the blockchain? Completely? Probably not 100% All the time. But I think we're probably going to start seeing more and more transactions where a house or a piece of property is in NFT, and ownership exchanges that way. Yeah, or yet, yet what's going to happen? And I don't have those solutions. And I don't have the ability to create all of that. But I am excited about what could be. 

Scott McGregor  31:29  
Hmm, no, a friend of mine actually just moved and had to wait. They sent, they sent their lawyer the money, the lawyer then sent it to the other lawyer and stuff like that. And I was helping this guy move. And he was essentially waiting outside of this new house, moving truck is there, my SUV is full of his stuff, and we can't put it in the house. Because the other lawyer, you know, the sellers lawyer was like, Yeah, we haven't gotten the money yet. And I thought, Wow, what a antiquated system where he knows it sent, he knows it's on the way, we're standing outside of a house, and he doesn't have the key can't go in because of time. And I thought, man, it's 2023 we have the technology, it just seems like a no brainer for so many different reasons. And you know, the owner could have the NFT of the house ownership on their phone. And it would just be way too easy. You know, there's so many use cases for NFT's that I think go beyond just memes and artwork and stuff like that, I do love the fact that it is starting out in kind of a fun, playful way, before it gets put on to, you know, a very serious business use case. Because people will be more comfortable with it in that way. You know, I think it has to it has to start as a fun playful toy, just like the internet was a fun playful toy. Now businesses can't operate without the internet, you know what I mean? And so I think that kind of stuff is coming. I just think it's going to take a while I agree with you, it's longer than we want it to, by the way...

Brett  33:12  
 I was literally gonna say the same thing. It's definitely taking longer than I want it to, and I want to see it move expeditiously. But, you know, they say marijuana is the gateway drug to other drugs. And I don't know that I really buy that. But that's what quote unquote, they say, but I feel like the memes are kind of the sort of gateway to other things. And you know, I have I have two kids, I share memes with them every single day I share memes with with my spouse, with my wife, share memes with my co workers, I share memes with my twitter friends. So we're all sharing this stuff because it's cool, or it's fun, or it makes us laugh. And when you can attach ownership to it as well. It just creates this feeling of you know, whether it's joy or happiness or just, you know, being proud that you own it or being part of the community or finding value from community or, you know, with my case wearing a t shirt from one of the meme communities like it's, it brings another aspect of two of your life that you wouldn't have otherwise. And it's just, it's exciting to be a part of it. Where we go from here, I don't really know. 

Scott McGregor  34:25  
I remember tweeting to Mark Yusko of a few months ago and it was about memes having value because memes are a part of culture. They're a part of our daily lives and and you know, if you think of other things that are a part of our daily lives that have tangible value, well why can't this joke have tangible value? You know, like, like when I was explaining about how I felt coming, you know, out of stock market world, Bitcoin world into this like meme coin, chaos. I referenced a meme because that's exists actly what popped in my mind first, and so I do believe that memes have value, because it's a part of culture and culture has value as well. Brett what would be a place for people to get started learning about some of these memes and some of these NFTs?

Brett  35:17  
I will get back to the advice that I was given before but, you know, find some NFTs or you know, memes. I'm going to speak specifically to NFTs there's a saying I like my name coins with JPEGs attached. But you know, start with dependencies, find some ones that are cool that you like, the ephors the wrecked guys, the means by six five to nine minutes are a little expensive, they start around to eat but a lot of the PFPs that just look neat or that you vibe with for some reason. And hopefully not spend more than you can't afford to lose but by it because it's cool by it because you like it, you know these, these behind me, the one directly above my head is just a good morning. So every day I like to say good morning to my my twitter friends and my Discord friends. And you know, the one above it is kind of hard to see I'll switch it here. But the kind of the graffiti art one is crypto daydreams. I just liked that style. And I just loved it, it was one of my favorite favorite ones. And then the ugly good bald guy on the on the other side there. That was one of my first I bought it's a regular. And you know, the concept with regulars is just to try to find someone I feel that looks similar to you. And I hope I don't categorize myself as an ugly bald guy. But that was the one that looked more closest to me. And plus, my wife hated it. But, you know, for whatever reason they vied for me and I liked them. And so I liked them enough that I put them on my wall and you know, this one here, you know, seasonings are production. This is a granion Enough tea that you know, if you were to buy his one offs there, you can spend 50 ETH on them. They're really they're really expensive, but I just wanted to be a part of a collector of something of his you know, so I put them on my wall just I see him every day. It makes me smile. And you know, I really liked him but you know, the MFers and the REKT Guys, I like those two I have a REKT guy. I don't have an MFer yet, but I think there's only you know, like 1% of the NFL owners right now are available to buy. So people are buying them they're holding them and they're they're not selling them because they want to be a part of that community. Hell one more and it sounds silly. I've never bought one but the Crypto Dick Butts like I know right crypto dick but I know I know. I will I will buy one one day but it's hard. I think the floor on those are like 1.3 ether so right now so you're talking yeah over 2000 US dollars to otter crypto dick but but from what I heard at I think it was consensus. They had the best kind of event party of all of them. They were the most most engaged community at Consensus, so crypto....

Scott McGregor  38:17  
Amazing. What about Nakamigo? So here's the thing Bret tells me about these NFT's and then I'm like, Oh yeah, I should go buy one of those. I have a regular I don't know I don't think I have any 6259 Memes but I do have a Nakamigo what's happening with Nakamigos right now and when are they going to the moon sir?

Brett  38:36  
I don't....I made the biggest mistake of not selling all of mine when they were almost at like one each. They're down to a floor price of like, 0.2 ETH right now.

Scott McGregor  38:51  
Good. I'm still up on mine. Yes!

Brett  38:54  
When the meme coin you know, season hit, I think all of the money went out of NF T's and you know, into meme coins. And you know, it happened with you know, the MFers,  REKT guys that happened with the Punk6529 memes that happened with everything so you just saw a huge bear market where people were piling out of NFT's and into main coins. So I've actually been buying them I have enough Nakamigos I don't feel I need to buy any more if I see one that's really cool and I like it I'll buy it because I want it but the issue that I have with them right now is there's no official Nakamigo Discord server it was just created by some dude and it's sort of self managed and the Nakamigo Twitter account, they post daily not the videos and like have they create a comment about it, but they're not really doing anything. The the interesting piece however, is the people connection and you know some of the other things that have happened like maybe there something there? Maybe there's not, we don't really know. I'm just going to hold on to him. I think what I've got and see what happens. It's it's worth the risk for me that it turns into the next. Crypto punks. I don't think it will. I don't think it will. But if it goes that direction at some point, it's worth the risk for me. And I think they're cool. And I like them. 

Scott McGregor  40:21  
So that's the interesting thing about some of these NFT's is just how crazy they can actually be like, I remember I bought Jack butcher's Checks for $8. Yeah, I bought it for $8. And then I sold it at $2,000. And like that's, that's a crazy return. And, and I didn't buy it because I thought it was going to be worth anything. I have a few of his other ones that aren't worth anything. And same thing with Nakamigos. So I'm like, okay, yeah, you know, I think I spent maybe $200, maybe $100? I don't remember. And thinking, Oh, I liked this picture. This is kind of fun. All right. Yeah, sure. Let's go. And same thing, it went up to almost 1 ETH. And so, you know, again, that little investment of $100 turned into, you know, almost $2,000. And of course, I didn't sell it because I'm just holding it. You know, we're in a we're in a winter right now you don't sell during the winter, you sell when everyone's crazy about it. And so, yeah, you know, that's the the interesting thing that I like about NFTs. But I can't pick them. Like, there's so many of them. I don't know, I have no edge in them. That's, that's I guess, my real, I guess. Thing is I don't have a strategy. I don't have a strategy to buy NFTs, I don't have a strategy to sell NFTs. I look at it as fun speculation right now? And is that kind of how you're thinking about it? As someone who has a lot of NFT's? Do you look at it as fun speculation? Or do you have like a strategy, okay, I'm gonna buy these napkin Mikos here as the prices are down, and then when it goes up, I'm gonna sell some recoup some of the money that I put in and see how it goes. 

Brett  42:03  
A little bit of all of that, a lot of them I'm buying just because it's it's fun speculation. It's just, I want to be a part of the community, I want to support the community, I want to own XYZ entity, there are some that I own that are Grails that I will probably never sell. So you know, I have a metal hardware, wallet, hardware wallet, they're not going out. But they are investments that I bought at a great time, and I'm just going to keep them. So some of them are sound strategic investments. I know that sounds crazy for JPEGs that we're talking about. But I legitimately believe that, you know, I've got some some good material there. And then I think, you know, if you think about you know, trading in general, if you're up 60% on an equity on a trade, maybe take some off the top, maybe sell 50% 25% Whatever that is maybe go back to house money. So one of the things that I need to improve on and I think for anybody listening, if they do get some, you know, a number of NFT's or crypto in general is, you know, if you're up significantly, maybe consider selling some, when people are the hype is going nuts, and everybody's going crazy. Maybe that might be the time for you to sell a little bit, you know, hold some for a moon bag. But, you know, I'm, I'm greedy. And I like to hold on to everything. And I just keep thinking that, you know, maybe these are the next crypto punks. And you know, that's my mistake for not selling. I've gotten better at it. But you know, I think I owned at one point, close to 20 Knock amigos. And when they were some of them, some one of them was a Kobe Mamba. And it was like, 4 or 5 ETH on the floor for it. And I didn't sell any of them. We're talking, you know, over 20-25 ETH worth of Nakamigos that are now not worth that much. So, you know, looking back, I wish I would have sold some, but I didn't know what they were gonna do. 

Scott McGregor  44:03  
Yeah, and I mean, that's the struggle too, because when you do become part of the community, I think it becomes harder to sell because then by selling you're kind of saying goodbye to the community. I mean, no one wants to be associated with someone who's, you know, every day I'm in there every day and then all of a sudden hey, guys, yeah, I forgot to tell you I sold three months ago, but I just been just been hanging out with you. So I understand that aspect of it because the emotional connection that you can have to that community, I think can actually be a hinderance when you're trading when you're trading some of these NFT's. 

Brett  44:39  
You're exactly right. And but that's the whole draw to it. I'll kind of close with this. The NFT's allow you to be a part of the community allow you to be a part of something bigger than yourself. Allow for just sort of collaborative design art. You know, trading is kind of like when you traded baseball cards as a kid, if anybody ever did that, you know, it's like, being able to do that with anybody in the world. And it kind of brings back fond memories. But, you know, you never really can grasp what's going to come of it, and who the people are you're going to meet and how you're going to come together. And, you know, at some point, even in person events, it's something that, you know, sort of the bonds and holds you together and is going to be, I think, intrinsically more important in our lives as this happen, especially with our kids lives. I think they're gonna have their own sort of PFPs and NFT's that associate directly to themselves, and they're gonna have tokenize, most everything. And we're just kind of now getting to the point where it's starting to understand it. And we're sort of like at the we're still, you know, Scott a year ago, I said, we're sort of at the genesis of, you know, as far as crypto like, where we were just figuring out how the Internet was going to work, like how we could do some things. Unfortunately, a year later, we're still kind of there. But things are moving. But they're just not moving as fast as I would like. 

Scott McGregor  46:05  
Awesome. Well, Brett, this has been really helpful. It's been helpful for me to help understand some of these meme coins. And then of course, I always love chatting NFT's with you, my friend. So thank you so much for your time. Great to connect again. And big thank you. To Brett Be sure and check him out on Twitter at crypto, Brett. And anything else you want to promote right now my friend.

Brett  46:29  
I'll say this. Get your get your valuables off of centralized exchanges. Get a hardware wallet. If you have some good FTS that you like. You know, get them off of your meta mask and put them somewhere that's safe. It'll leave it there.

Scott McGregor  46:45  
Awesome. If you found this helpful. Click follow leave a review and check out our back catalogue at hot I'm Scott McGregor. That's Brett we'll see you next time.